Humanist Society interview series: Maggie Chapman MSP on ending conversion practices
June 27, 2025
To mark the end of Pride Month, we speak to Green MSP and longstanding social justice campaigner Maggie Chapman about why conversion practices must end in Scotland.
Hi Maggie! Please introduce yourself…
I’m Maggie. I’m a longtime political activist and social justice campaigner. I cut my teeth on campaigning in Zimbabwe, where I was born and brought up. But for the last four years I’ve been Scottish Green MSP for North East Scotland.
I am the Scottish Green Party’s spokesperson for Equalities, Human Rights, Justice and Social Justice. This is a set of portfolios I am proud to hold. It gives me the ability to drive the Scottish Greens’ approach to equalities legislation in the Scottish Parliament, and push for a human rights-based approach in all we do.
I was very disappointed – and quite angry – when the Scottish government decided to drop not just one, but three human rights-based pieces of legislation this year. These were the misogyny bill, a comprehensive ban on conversion practices, and a Scottish human rights bill. It seems that equalities and human rights have become a low priority of this parliament.
This is worrying, and potentially dangerous for many. The increasingly toxic culture wars being waged against trans people, people of colour, and disabled people means that we must stand resolute with marginalised groups. Human rights breaches are all too common at home and around the world.
Deferring to the UK Labour Government on ending conversion practices, as the Scottish government has done, only serves to put more people at risk.
Why do we need to end conversion practices in Scotland?
I am honoured to be deputy convener of the Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee. It was this committee that undertook an inquiry into a comprehensive ban on conversion practices towards the start of this parliamentary session. The evidence we collected was overwhelmingly clear. We need to end conversion practices in Scotland.
The UK recently moved to its lowest position ever on the European ranking for equalities. Clearly work is being done, across committees, by MSPs, in campaign groups, and elsewhere. But we’re falling behind on really ensuring that rights are made real. We cannot simply pay lip service to our values. We must act to secure the protections that are so desperately needed in these dark times.
As co-convenor of the LGBTI+ Cross-Party Group, I wrote to the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice back in September about the work that Scottish Government was doing with Westminster on creating a ban. Deferring to the UK Labour Government on this, as the Scottish government has done, only serves to put more people at risk. We have the power and political will to introduce a comprehensive ban in Scotland now. We should grasp that opportunity with both hands.
We need to see real commitment to change from the Scottish government. That means making sure the next Scottish government knows that advocacy organisations and the general public want to see this as a high priority next session. If we keep making noise and mobilise, this is possible.
Trans people have been cynically targeted and demonised by politicians and large parts of the media for far too long.
Why is it important that trans people are protected by any measures to end conversion practices?
Any ban on conversion practices must be trans-inclusive and comprehensive. Trans people have been cynically targeted and demonised by politicians and large parts of the media for far too long. This has contributed to attacks on longstanding rights and attempts to erase their existence altogether.
Indeed, we’re seeing much of the same vile rhetoric used against gay people in the time of Section 28 and the AIDS crisis now being leveraged against transgender people. Back then, legislative changes didn’t immediately change the tide, but they were part of quietening the very loud minority who lobbied hard against equal rights.
With trans people under fire every day, a conversion practices ban which includes protections for them would be a significant cushion against the hateful bigotry that is spewed against them. No trans person should ever be told that they are wrong, or broken. No trans person should ever be subjected to practices which can amount to torture just for being who they are.
No trans person should ever be told that they are wrong, or broken. No trans person should ever be subjected to practices which can amount to torture just for being who they are.
How do policymakers ensure that LGBT+ people living in closed-off religious communities are protected by this legislation?*
The greatest risk here is perhaps to young people, who otherwise have little independence from their community, or their schooling. This is why we need to support the work of incredible organisations such as Time for Inclusive Education (TIE) who work to improve education on queer rights and equalities in schools.
But the often isolated nature of these practices gives all the more reason for a ban. Currently, if teachers suspect a pupil is being forced into conversion practices, they would have no legal backing to report this as abuse. This is despite the profound emotional and spiritual harm caused to people who are forced to undergo conversion practices. Only a ban would allow teachers or other public officials with safeguarding duties to protect LGBT+ people from these awful practices.
Out of school environments, MSPs, through parliament and their constituencies, should also promote inclusion in our public spaces, ensuring they are welcoming of people from all faiths. Those in closed-off communities should have greater access to spaces where can make new connections and perhaps be protected from abuse.
The Supreme Court ruling is deeply concerning for human rights and a huge blow to some of the most marginalised people in our society.
The recent Supreme Court ruling has sparked real fear in the trans community. What must politicians do to allay those fears?
The Supreme Court ruling is deeply concerning for human rights and a huge blow to some of the most marginalised people in our society. It has already caused the removal of important protections. It will leave many trans people and their loved ones deeply anxious and worried about how their lives will be affected. Trans people just want to be able to live their lives like any of us, without the fear of prejudice or violence. This ruling has only made that harder to do.
Politicians must make their allyship count. They need to be loud, proud, and consistent about their support for trans people. Those who are not will find themselves to have been on the wrong side of history. On social media, with constituents, in our approach to legislation, we must never forget that this is not just about trans people, it is about upholding our long-held value as a progressive, human rights-based nation.
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*The 2018 National LGBT Survey found that 51% of conversion practices take place in religious settings.
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